Welcome one and all to the big #Linux BS thread! I get that it's necessary to switch to Linux, I'm imploring you to do so, and I don't want to discourage anyone but I need to document the ways in which Linux is just not ready for 600 Million more users and I don't think it's any technical limitation so much as a lack of design self-awareness.
Case study 1: A basic 1GHz Intel netbook with 4GB RAM. I installed #Manjaro. Keys, touchpad, wifi and screen brightness work, very impressive. I also really like that Manjaro is not dumbed down and I was able to get plenty of information about the hardware.
But hibernate doesn't work. Clicking the button does nothing -- already a design flaw in that it can't even tell me why it isn't working. A quick Internet search lets me know that systemctl hibernate is the console command for invoking hibernate and should give me an error message. The swapfile size is not big enough, just 512MB for a machine with 4GB of RAM.
Can I resize the swapfile, using dd and a number of other systemctl commands? Yes! Should I have to? No! If I enable hibernation and it can't hibernate because the swapfile is too small then it should TELL ME and provide a GUI to fix it, and that's without considering that it should have set the swapfile size big enough during installation anyway!
But still, that's not enough. Despite having a hibernate feature, the installation didn't modify initramfs & GRUB to handle hibernation! Can I do this manually? Yes! Do / Should I have / want to? Absolutely not!
Now downloading #Kubuntu in hopes that its own features actually work out-of-the-box :|
[#]KDE #LinuxIsNotReadyYet
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
There is a special place in hell for error messages that give a list of instructions to follow, rather than a button to actually just do the thing.
Why is this message appearing? What does any of this mean to someone who doesn't know what these things are? Wayland? KWin? Fctix? (I know what these are, but there's 600 million soon-to-be-deprecated Windows users who don't)
[#]Linux #KDE #Kubutnu #LinuxIsNotReadyYet
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
[#]Kubuntu hibernate doesn't work out of the box, so this is likely more to do with #KDE in general. That said, I did find a "solution", or rather an install option that makes hibernate work as advertised. #Manjaro does give an option for "swap with hibernate" during partitioning. Why was this not exposed in Kubutnu?
Again, my complaint is not that hibernate doesn't work because I didn't RTFM and do the leet hax in the terminal, but that under default options, the hibernate feature is present but does not work when initiated and worse still, does not communicate why nor provide a graphical means of resolving. Even Windows has a GUI for managing the swap file.
If you've had a machine running #Linux for a while and you decide to utilise hibernate at that crucial moment and it doesn't work unless you reinstall your OS or re-partition your drive and rebuild the intramfs / grub, likely requiring a reboot anyway -- why is the feature even presented as available!??
[#]LinuxIsNotReadyYet
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
Problem #2: I use #CloudFlare WARP (https://1.1.1.1) to avoid traffic blocking on public wifi spots as I move around a lot with a laptop. On Windows, I just download and install it.
CloudFlare provide APT or YUM packages for #Linux. You're on #Arch (#Manjaro)? Well, I hope you like the terminal!
I am more resourceful than most, for I suspect the majority of current Windows 10 users would be stumped at that point. I happen to know that I can enable the AUR repository for some more software and there is a build script provided there: https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/cloudflare-warp-bin Note how in the first comment that it won't work until you use the terminal to enable the service.
Regardless, something is amiss, as even when I enable the service and reboot, it's not the same UI as on Windows and doesn't even seem to be the same program. It wants me to sign in to some corporate web interface and not just enable secure DNS tunneling via a simple toggle. Here, I am at a loss.
I have installed Linux 5 times now, but now I need to change to another distro that uses APT or YUM, but also has working hibernate!
Now, the current state of obtaining third-party software in #Linux is much like the warring states of feudal Japan with no clear Nobunaga (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oda_Nobunaga) yet to unite the Linux software ecosystem. I don't really have a recommendation here for Manjaro, or #KDE; this is a fundamental problem with the lack of binary stability in Linux software but a lot more consideration should be given to end users who just want to run software and less attention to warring factions trying to be the one true standard (Flatpack etc)
[#]LinuxIsNotReadyYet
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
Sometimes you can't make this stuff up
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
Installed #Debian (#KDE), hibernate works by default. Uses Kernel 6.1 and older software like Firefox ESR. I would recommend Debian if you want a super-stable KDE-based desktop, but I need something more up-to-date (but not bleeding-edge!) because as a developer I invariably end up needing to install a more recent version of a program over the LTS versions.
Now installing #Fedora 41 (KDE) because I read that it uses Kernel 6.11. This is the 7th time I've installed #Linux but I'm starting to narrow things down.
β edit: Fedora 41 does not support hibernate, lol π
[#]LinuxIsNotReadyYet
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
Time for #OpenSuSE Tumbleweed! https://get.opensuse.org/tumbleweed/ The installer is quite involved but it does at least have an option to set the swap size to the RAM size! Does "for suspend" mean hibernate? I'm not sure, but we'll find out.
[#]linux #LinuxIsNotReadyYet
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
Going to try #Debian testing; instructions say install stable and then switch to the testing branch...
WHY ISN'T THIS JUST A DROP-DOWN TO SELECT THE BRANCH YOU INSANE PEOPLE!?
[#]linux #LinuxIsNotReadyYet
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
@Kroc You can find the installer for Debian testing here: https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from frehi@fosstodon.org
@frehi I was following instructions. I also installed the testing ISO and it appeared [to my limited knowledge] to put me on the Trixie branch, not on testing; and whilst that amounts to the same thing for now, I would still need to edit the sources to remain on the testing branch
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
@Kroc @frehi Open /etc/apt/sources.list in a sudo'd text editor. You can see whether it's on Trixie or Testing in there and edit the sources used for your system there.
See official documentation: https://wiki.debian.org/SourcesList
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from RandamuMaki@mastodon.social
@RandamuMaki @frehi Thanks, but Iβm also highlighting how unreasonable this is for the 600 million Windows 10 users that should switch to Linux. I know how to sudo edit files, but most donβt, and shouldnβt have to :(
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
@Kroc @frehi Not unreasonable at all. #Linux doesn't have to cater to people who don't want to learn to use it.
This might sound harsh, but as with all new things; Just read the manual. #RTFM
There are other distros around who decide everything for you, like what #Windows users are used to.
Linux doesn't do as much handholding or deciding things for you as Redmond's OS.
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from RandamuMaki@mastodon.social
@Kroc @RandamuMaki @frehi Debian testing is definitely unsuitable as a stand in for windows. Clue is in the name.
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from ChrisWere@toot.wales
@Kroc @frehi Then use #KDE , use the Discover program, and change the sources there in the GUI. There's a dropdown there.
KDE is almost a drop-in replacement for the #Windows experience on #Linux .
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from RandamuMaki@mastodon.social
@RandamuMaki @frehi Ironically, that's actually what I'm using -- and the sources window won't open for some reason!! :P If you read up the thread, I've been trying to find a KDE distro that has working hibernate and whilst #Manjaro has been the best option so far, very little 3rd party software is packaged for it
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
@Kroc @frehi You might want to drop a bugreport about the sources window not opening at the project's gitlab; https://invent.kde.org/plasma/discover
@kde@floss.social @kde@lemmy.ml might be of help with your problems with regards to hibernation not working with #KDE .
Flipping distros just because a package running on that distro doesn't behave as you think it should is not exactly going to help you in most cases. You could try source-building on #Gentoo or #Arch , but #YMMV .
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from RandamuMaki@mastodon.social
@Kroc @RandamuMaki @frehi
Because Debian does not want you to install testing or unstable unless you know what you are doing.
Which is correctr.
Those 600 million Windows 10 users would all shoot themselves in the feet with testing.
And so will you, if you think that testing is a good daily driver without having sufficient experience to make an informed decision.
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from dashdsrdash@tilde.zone
What @dashdsrdash said. People who want to switch away from Windows are not the target audience for Debian Testing.
If for some reason you want more up-to-date software than is offered in Debian Stable, the answer within the Debian ecosystem is to use the official backports repository. However, in doing so, you trade off explicit security support; which is quite often a bad trade-off.
I use and like Debian. But Testing and Unstable are what they say on the tin.
@Kroc @RandamuMaki @frehi
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from mkj@social.mkj.earth
@Kroc
Trixie is testing...
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from frehi@fosstodon.org
@frehi As per the wiki, Trixie is currently testing, but that won't be true when Trixie is released
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from Kroc@oldbytes.space
@Kroc Obviously? If you use the testing installer now, you get Trixie = testing. if you want trixie when it's stable, you wait until it gets released and get the stable installer. Nor sure what else you would expect.
=> More informations about this toot | More toots from frehi@fosstodon.org This content has been proxied by September (3851b).Proxy Information
text/gemini