Question for the covid-cautious community:
I know some people use iota-carrageenan nasal sprays as an additional measure on top of masks, air cleaning, ventilation, etc. I've heard of people using them for high-risk situations like airplanes or medical appointments.
I'm wondering - not for me, for someone who is not happy wearing a mask - would using a nasal spray INSTEAD of a mask be a "better than nothing" option? Is iota-carrageenan nasal spray safe to use daily?
Thanks!
[#]CovidIsNotOver
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@ikuo1000
It's certainly better than nothing.
I can't comment on ioto… however Enovid has served me and (in particular) friends (who've been forced to travel a fair amount recently) well:
https://buyenov.com
There's also Profi:
https://www.profispray.com
though I don't have personal experience with that.
Maybe consider also far-UV?
https://www.nukit222.com
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@mmalc Thank you for your response!
I don't think Nukit is an option by nature of it being highly visible and even less prevalent than masks (thus requiring more explanation).
How often do you use Enovid? Is there anything on the label about daily/extended use?
I'm intrigued by Profi!! The website image of the product says "Everyday Nasal Spray" on the label, and this article makes it sound promising:
https://hms.harvard.edu/news/drug-free-nasal-spray-may-shield-against-respiratory-infections
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@ikuo1000
I use Enovid every day. I interact with others extremely rarely but I prefer to do so in case e.g. I end up in conversation with a passing neighbour (esp. if for some reason I'm not wearing a mask).
Friends who've traveled mask and use Enovid at least daily.
I'm intrigued by Profi as well! Enovid seems to have more "weight" behind it (studies) for now, but Profi seems to pass the … sniff test. I’d be keen to know if it's OK to use both…
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@mmalc Thanks for sharing this info! It's so helpful to know people's experiences, even if it's anecdotal.
re: taking both Profi & Enovid - I found this article with a more cautious stance: https://cen.acs.org/materials/biomaterials/biopolymers-behind-multimodal-nasal-spray/102/i30
"Aaron Glatt, an epidemiologist at Mount Sinai South Nassau points out the lack of information about potential allergic responses, as well as the potential for interaction with other medications... “I would be very concerned about anybody using this without any evidence in humans.” 🤷🏻♀️
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@ikuo1000
Ah, thank you, I hadn’t seen that one.
Yes, caution.
FWIW, although I’m becoming more confident in Enovid, my personal attitude is to behave as if it doesn’t work and don’t take any more risks than I would otherwise. If it does confer extra protection, then that’s a bonus.
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@ikuo1000
Better than nothing? I'd say yes. Personally, I wouldn't be comfortable using just nasal spray, but when I had to go to the DMV and they wouldn't allow me inside with a mask I used "Flo travel spray" and chewed PUR gum when inside.
As to the safety, there's some data out there:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7880062/
I'd say yes to the safety off hand, under the umbrella of "I don't know if it's been studied for long term, daily use" off the top of my head. My wife has used it many times and thinks that she sometimes gets a sore throat the day after using it. She's not 100% sure that's the cause, but she thinks so.
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@ikuo1000
Oh, we've also had no qualms about letting our kids use it, either, if that data point helps. Sporadically, not every day, but still.
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@BE Thank you! I appreciate this information a lot, and the link to the study is very hepful.
Sounds like iota-carrageenan is certainly safe as an antiviral treatment, and it may prevent recurrent or co-infections, but still there's nothing specific about safety if used every day in the absence of an infection, which means I'm still wary, especially given your wife's experience...
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@ikuo1000
No problem. We have no concerns about its safety, but we also don't go out daily, so we've never really thought about it as a daily thing. Perhaps some other people in the COVID cautious community do use it daily.
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@BE @ikuo1000 Kia ora, my kids have been using flo travel spray every day before and after school for over a year now. They haven't had any issues like scratchy throats or similar.
As it's saline-based, it's said to be safe to use daily; I'm no doctor though. the dosage info says 3x daily or more often as needed.
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@ConnyChiwa Thank you! This is very helpful!
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@ikuo1000 It is better than nothing (and it's safe to use every few hours, label usually says every 6) but it's not much better than nothing.
Best-and-brightest nasal spray results are about 60% protective; middle-of-the-values is more like 40% protective.
With a five shot revolver, you'd be playing Russian Roulette with two or three of the five chambers loaded.
With a respirator, you've completely unloaded the revolver; you're at risk from stray bullets from elsewhere.
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@graydon OH! Thank you, I appreciate these insights a lot.
I agree, a good mask is the best protection, and I'm only considering this option in the case of someone being adamant about NOT wearing a mask.
By any chance do you have any links to the sources that say nasal sprays are only 40-60% protective? Thank you.
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@ikuo1000 https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8493111/ would be 80% protective in the simple model, but also "formal study with medical professionals as subjects", so better than generally expected. (1 - 0.2)^10 ≅11% chance of avoiding infection.
This one https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1386653222001809 gets a 60% reduction.
This is not a deeply studied area. It's very likely anything reducing viral replication in your nose helps when infected, but how much exactly is not firmly established. Prevention is preferable.
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@ikuo1000 Any prevention actions are better than none, but I want to be clear that I would never recommend something "instead of" masking. That said, I'm in the US and use a xylitol nasal spray and CPC mouthwash in addition to masks. Both are safe for multiple daily uses. Sounds like iota-carrageenan nasal sprays like Nasitrol are equally safe to use several times a day.
Once my xylitol spray runs out, I'll be switching to hypochlorous acid (HOCl) for both nasal spray and mouthwash (CPC can turn your teeth brown). HOCl is cheap to DIY at home and is surprisingly safe and effective.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34236253/
Indoor air filters such as Corsi-Rosenthal boxes and just general air circulation and ventilation would of course also be helpful. I would basically be pushing every other prevention method if someone will not mask.
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@Raptorrrr Thank you for weighing in! I appreciate your perspective.
Yes, I agree, nasal sprays are no substitute for masks and I wouldn't "recommend" it. I'm just considering it as a "better than nothing last resort" option for daily situations like school or work, where the person must go but refuses to mask and has no control over ventilation or air cleaning.
I haven't heard of hypochlorous acid! I will check out your link. Thanks.
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@ikuo1000 A loved one is having chemo, won’t mask, and I’ve gently encouraged the use of the nasal spray (by giving them some) because any mitigation is better than nothing. I'm fairly sure it stopped us catching the rotten cold someone was incubating and spreading at our family Christmas (we'd all tested for Covid). It slightly irritates my nasal passages and this increases with use but sensitivity must vary.
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@goldfish Awww, it must be so hard to watch a loved one go through chemo, being immunocompromised, and not masking! I had chemo in pre-covid times and still my nurse recommended I wear a surgical mask if in the presence of others who may be sick.
It's very kind and thoughtful of you to provide them with nasal spray!! And your anecdotal story is encouraging. Thank you for sharing. May I ask which specific brand you used?
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@ikuo1000 Thank you for your kind words. The brand we use is Nozirite. I'm in the UK so I'm not sure if that's available everywhere.
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@ikuo1000 I have no knowledge of this, beyond what I've learned from the discussion between you and Graydon, but am very interested in the subject because I live with someone who cannot stand masks. For that person, frequent vaccination with Novavax is the only means of protection. I would love to identify a second means of protecting them.
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@Lkdc Please stick around and read some of the other comment threads, too! 😄 Several people have weighed in with their experiences with all different kinds of nasal sprays. I'm learning a lot and really appreciate all the feedback.
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@ikuo1000 My Mastodon app doesn't show any responses except for those by Graydon and you, so I opened the thread on the web, and now I see the other responses that you referred to. It's fascinating reading about all the different sprays!
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@Lkdc OH! I'm aware that that sometimes happens - that some responses in threads may be hidden because of the way the servers are connected? - but I don't understand the details and I'm glad you found a way to read the other responses! 😁
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@ikuo1000 in my experience, when i used that spray daily, it started hurting my lungs, so i had to quit. personally, i think the sprays are either misused or scams. like, if it’s supposed to protect your lungs (+ it hurts for the spray to reach them), and if your breath goes beyond your nose anyway, is it actually doing anything?
tl;dr, i don’t recommend it in general. <:/
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@splitseq Thanks for sharing your experience!
I am obviously just learning about the different kinds of nasal sprays, but my understanding is that many of them are meant to be a physical barrier in the nose, so not meant to be inhaled all the way into the lungs. Maybe it's a matter of proper technique when spraying?
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