Your most used credit/debit card has…
[You can use the final option for Apple/Google/Samsung pay on your mobile/cellular, or if you use a wearable payment device]
P.S. By "account number", in this case I mean card number (Amex, Discover, MasterCard, UnionPay, Visa, etc. number). Not your bank account number.
I wonder if things have already shifted since last time. 🤔
https://velocipederider.com/@ruari/113142278460382792
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One of my own numberless† cards, for those that have not seen such things before. Other companies that offer them include Chase (UK) and also the Apple card.
And yes this is a real, usable card and no I did not remove anything. This is how it is issued.
† It has a number obviously, just not printed on the card. I can access it though the app and website associated with my account and I also store it in my password manager for convenience.
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Here is an old image of more of my cards. I switched some of them since this picture but still none have any card account number on the front, unlike my cards further in the past.
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The obvious advantage of stripping the numbers off the front (or entirety) of the card is for security/privacy. If they are seen† it is not possible for a nefarious person to memorise or quickly photograph the number.
Indeed I cannot think of any good reason for modern cards to continue to print the number across the front. If your bank does, maybe tell them to stop it.
† Just a few years back I could not have posted a picture like this on social media without compromising my account details.
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Having an embossed card seems particularly stupid in 2025. Those old "Knuckle Busters" cannot be used anywhere, anymore. So there is no advantage to them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_card_imprinter
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Just to clarify one point, card imprinters might now be pointless but I do personally think they were a brilliant solution at the time. They are so much quicker (and more accurate) at recording the account details than someone handwritting them out. So while their time has come and gone, hats off to whichever individual(s) that came up with this idea in the first place. It was a brilliant little hack.
[And yes I am using "hack" in it's more traditional sense]
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I'm also curious if anyone has a physical payment card without a magnetic stripe.
Technically I do but I am not sure it counts as it is a microcard.
Let's see if anyone else does. Do you have a full size credit/debit card which came without any magnetic stripe?
[If you have such a card and if you don't mind, name the bank/fintech company in the comments below]
https://www.mastercard.com/news/perspectives/2021/magnetic-stripe/
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P.S. For anyone curious about my reference to a microcard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZ3m8LW5plw
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Sadly one of the providers I use that used to issue micro payment cards has dropped them from their offerings (Bank Norwegian/Nordax). I still have a microcard with them and it works but they will not issue new ones in the future. They are commiting further to mobile and smartwatch payments instead.
That is a real shame IMHO but on the flipside I have at least one other provider where they are still continuing to support them going forward (for now at least).
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@ruari
If all cards were still embossed then the non connected backup might have a place.
None out of several cards in my wallet are embossed.
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@boxofrain I was on a plane recently and bought a drink. I had no internet access and honestly I do not think the terminals they used did either. I normally get instant notifications on my phone for payments I make on certain cards (including the one I used). My phone notified me two days later of that transaction. Looking at my account, the payment was recorded on the 23rd but I flew on the 21st. Those airline terminals can clearly take payments offline for later processing.
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@boxofrain Some of these planes do have internet access but even then it tends to go in and out of service. Thus their terminals would need to have been designed this way because they cannot just stop processing payments from customers when outages are so frequent.
So we no longer need the card imprinters, even for outages/offline payments, as long as internet connectivity is eventually restored.
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@boxofrain I suspect most terminals cannot do this and/or most companies are not allowed to process payments in this way. I assume that the airlines have negotiated something special with the banks due to their situation with network access being intermittent. But it shows… it is possible. We do not need the old tech.
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@ruari @boxofrain my understanding (I work in a payments related industry) is that it's not any sort of special deal the airlines have. It's just that an acquirer doesn't want to do the offline transaction if they can help it, because there's more chance of them being on the hook for costs if the transaction is rejected.
So if someone takes your card and you cancel it, when they try to use it, the acquirer will ask the card issuer if the transaction is legit and the issuer will say no, transaction denied. But if the thief gets on a plane before you cancel it, their transactions will go through and ultimately it's the acquirer (the airlines bank) that eats the loss.
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@Scmbradley Ok so in summary pretty much any business could do the initial transaction offline but they have to swallow the risk.
However that would also be true (need to swallow the risk) with a card imprinter (assuming that was even allowed). So in the modern world the imprinter offers no real advantage.
@boxofrain
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@ruari
I get all that.
But one can imagine the terminals not working for one reason or another.
But once cards don’t have embossed numbers - as they now mostly don’t at least in Europe - then the mechanical readers really don’t make any sense.
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@boxofrain I see your argument that it works both ways. Without embossing it is not possible to use old tech. But that old tech has other problems. It records the number on the receipt. Modern receipts never show the full number. If you lose your receipt on the ground or the merchant does not look after their copy well, someone can copy the details
The payment processors do not want that old tech to work because it is not secure. So these were always going away. So embossing is now pointless.
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@ruari And speaking of these, we had similar at a store I worked at for the times the magnetic stripe stopped working. I remember coming across a discover card that was the first card I saw without the embossed numbers.
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@linnefaulk Yeah it in the past but you will note from the wikipedia article I linked to that card imprinters stopped being accepted anywhere in the 2020s, so there would be no use pulling them out now. The banks would not accept payments taken in this way anymore.
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@ruari wow I didn't know that was the reason for embossed cards 😮
I'd just assumed they were just there for style or something 😅
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@badrihippo Well I am old enough to recall seeing them used.
At least I recall my parents handing over cards to be imprinted this way. I don't think I have ever used one with my own cards that I recall.
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@badrihippo Credit Cards are full of redundant methods for getting account information off them
In Norway these days it is 90% contactless with the very occasionally insert of the chip. You can remove all 3 of the above and it would not really matter at all.
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@badrihippo As you see from my first image at least one of my cards is numberless. It has a number associated but it is not written on the card anywhere.
However it still has the mag stripe which cannot be used anywhere in Norway. So still at least one redundant thing remains.
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@ruari Years ago the power went out while I was at Target. There were emergency lights and the registers worked but they couldn’t contacts the banks. The cashiers had to pull out those old cc contraptions that run the card over a receipt with carbon copies. The younger cashiers had never seen them before. I guess if it happened today, no one could check out. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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@linnefaulk If there is emergency power they technically could. Now it might be that those registers are not configured for offline processing but such things can be done.
https://velocipederider.com/@ruari/113905164714384902
P.S. I doubt those card imprinters would work now anyway because the upstream processors would not accept payments handled this way. The imprinted receipts (user and merchant copy) has the full CC details. If anyone loses track it allows copying. Modern receipts never have the full details.
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@ruari I realize that almost everything has gone electronic. I wish the US would catch up to the rest of the world.
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@ruari
My bank does the stupidest thing :
They removed the number from the front, and put it in the back. With the CVV (CSC/CVC/CAV/CID/CVD… the three/four digits validation code on the card). So a picture of only one side of the card is enough to do anything.
Oh and their multi factor authentication for web login uses 1. A password of 8 char, only digits, and 2. A code sent by email.
So stupid.
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@ruari same here, my cards don't have my info on the front anymore
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@mathieulefrancois But they do on the back? 😉
Your next card might not have it there either!
Indeed your next card might not even have a magnetic strip!
https://www.mastercard.com/news/perspectives/2021/magnetic-stripe/
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@ruari Yeah, I guess one step at a time!
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@ruari I'm surprised that any have customisation on the front - all of mine now only need single-sided printing. I've only ever had a few exceptions with printed (rather than embossed) individualised text on the front
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@HodgesC Yes of these the only one with custom text on the front is the Amex.
I have a different Amex now but it is the same in that it has my name, "member since" date and the four digit CVV (Card Verification Value) digits on the front.
To be honest I am not particularly happy with the CVV being on the front and I think that Amex should drop that as another security/privacy issue.
It is one of the reasons the image is arranged like this, so I could use the white card to cover it up. 😉
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@HodgesC LOL, Amex, so why the fuck do you print it on the front of the card then. 🤣
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@HodgesC Ideally it should not have my name on the front either. I posted it because my name is already known on social media but I do not want it on the front of my card.
If I have my card out at a resturant while I wait to pay (face up) I do not want random other people nearby knowing my name.
It is not so much a security issue as a privacy one. Hell why do other people even need to see my years of membership detail?
The Amex cards are the least private of the cards I own.
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@ruari it seems like the meaning of "front" and "back" has almost swapped since embossing went away. Nnow we have logo/chip side and text/stripe side. Having the CVV and card number on opposite faces might have some benefit as they can't be captured in the same image
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@HodgesC
Having the CVV and card number on opposite faces might have some benefit as they can't be captured in the same image
True when both sides were used historically. Anyway, Amex was always bad here as they had both of the front before. Still, these days it is better to have a single secure side, so that you can always place it the right way to hide everything.
Actually… better to have basically nothing and be "numberless" like the white card. But the back side for all, is next best.
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@ruari I know how I'd deal with numberless cards (store all the details in my password manager) but it's still handy to be able to get my card out of my pocket at my desk in work to pay online.
The thing about all the details on the back is they could be captured by a pinhole camera hidden under the card reader - an optical card skimmer - except for where they're hidden by your fingers
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@HodgesC
but it's still handy to be able to get my card out of my pocket at my desk in work to pay online.
So write out the details on a piece of paper and put this in your wallet as well. 🤷 You will not take this out every time you take out your card, so it is still more secure.
And if you are worried that someone might access your wallet or you lose it leaving your card compromised. Well… since you card is in there as well, that is the case anyway. So you are no worse off. 🤔
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@HodgesC Really I do not see any reason why the details need to be on the card itself any more. Indeed when your provider first sends you the card, they could also provide you a laminated copy of the raw details. Then it is up to you if you put this in your physical (or online wallet/password manager), keep it in a safe or maybe even memorise and just destroy it.
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@ruari All true (though a home-made bit of paper isn't as waterproof and I carry more than enough crap in my wallet). Or go the other way as my dad does - use the physical card as that document with details, but pay using an NFC wristband - which I think is close to where you started this thread
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@HodgesC Or even a ring 😉
https://www.paycelet.de/en/products/paycelet-bezahlring-orbit-black
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@HodgesC Fidesmo has quite a lot of partners offering a range or products like that, perhaps even what your dad already uses.
https://fidesmo.com/consumer/wearables/
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@HodgesC Nice thing is that even if your bank does not support Fidesmo wearables, you can always link you current card(s) though Curve, who do support Fidesmo and thus get pretty much any Visa or Mastercard to work as a wearable.
https://www.curve.com/en/wearables
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text/gemini
