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Posted in IRC Logs at 5:09 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz
Enter the IRC channel now
jose“As things are, if we make an “invention” (and don’t patent it), we open it up to the world to use (like BSD), but if MS creates one (and patents it), we can’t use theirs. In both cases, a person stood on shoulders of giants, but only one of these “inventors” allowed others to stand even higher ..and it was the nice inventors (FOSS) that ended up with the short end of the stick! That is bad way to reward innovation — a fundamental sOct 29 00:01josecrew-up of patent law.”Oct 29 00:01schestowitzNot destroy the broken law and preserve sane laws?Oct 29 00:02schestowitz reads.Oct 29 00:02schestowitzDo you know how much a patent costs to garden?Oct 29 00:03josei’m all for destroying broken PUKE laws.. but see what i wroteOct 29 00:03joseyes, i know that is not prettyOct 29 00:03schestowitzIt’s a law created by the wealthy, for the wealthy.Oct 29 00:03joseactually could you enlightenOct 29 00:03schestowitzWe should post it in BN for some feedback maybe.Oct 29 00:03josewhat would costs be likeOct 29 00:04joseresearch and write-up could be free in a senseOct 29 00:04joseand lawyers might participateOct 29 00:04joseactual filing fees and other costs?Oct 29 00:04schestowitz done readingOct 29 00:05josemaybe we could do a shared partnership where nonFOSS can payOct 29 00:05schestowitzPatents are hugely expensive and time consuming.Oct 29 00:06joseand the cosponsor (covering costs) would get a good percentage of such royaltiesOct 29 00:06josefor regular dev, yesOct 29 00:06schestowitzFFII works to eliminate swpats and related laws, whereas OIN does a Mixican shootout type-thing.Oct 29 00:06joseactually, IBM patented something along the lines of using patents to protect small businesses or FOSSOct 29 00:06josei agree with ffiiOct 29 00:07josethat is why i wanted opinionsOct 29 00:07joseto lay everything on the tableOct 29 00:07schestowitzDon’t fire fire with fire. You’ll get BURNED. Oct 29 00:07josei know thatOct 29 00:07joseyet we fight copyright with copyleftOct 29 00:07schestowitzDon’t wrestle with a pig… you both get dirty, but only the pig enjoys it.. or the TROLL.Oct 29 00:07josei’ve heard that one before here.. Oct 29 00:08schestowitzYes, not mine.Oct 29 00:08schestowitzTim O’Reilly used it last year (borrowed it from someone).Oct 29 00:08schestowitzIs it patented? Oct 29 00:08josei don’t want to attempt wasting times on patentsOct 29 00:09schestowitzNobody is willing.Oct 29 00:09josebut if we were going to do it.. if it could work out practically.. then you’d want to win that game if possibleOct 29 00:09josei am notOct 29 00:09schestowitzFOSS is popular because programmers love code.Oct 29 00:09josebutOct 29 00:09josesome people don’t mindOct 29 00:09schestowitzFiling stupid papers and hiring lawyers is a chore.Oct 29 00:09josethey may want incentives thoughOct 29 00:09schestowitzOnly Novell devs do such nonsense.Oct 29 00:10josethe license would be set up so that anyone could step up and do the chore thoughOct 29 00:11joseand we would all benefitOct 29 00:11joseit’s like the gplv3 i thinkOct 29 00:11joseexcept to add more lubrication in our favorOct 29 00:12joselike foss, anyone can pick it up and run with itOct 29 00:12joseand like gpl, we’d all be guaranteed to benefitOct 29 00:12schestowitzWho would volunteer to just file for patents?Oct 29 00:13schestowitzAnd this still isn’t protection from trolls.Oct 29 00:13josesome people might volunteer. if we could play that game well.. to lead to MAD, then more would be willing to take time to lend a handOct 29 00:14josetrolls would be unsafe if we get enough and if they ever want to use real software for anything in their livesOct 29 00:14josepersonally, i would like to add that “interests” in a company filing for patents puts you at stakeOct 29 00:15josei wish the gpl had done thatOct 29 00:15joseif the license is open ended enough, it would really accel MADOct 29 00:16josesure, we wouldn’t get IBM contributionsOct 29 00:16josei think this is dealing with puke, but maybe under the right circumstances, we might get a lot of support.. users contributing would benefit .. like with FOSS, most would benefit except a small fraction (shrink-wrapped/ patent mongers)Oct 29 00:18schestowitzHow about a peripheral ‘patent’ body?Oct 29 00:19jose?Oct 29 00:19schestowitzLike online patent placements?Oct 29 00:19schestowitzMake a farce of USPTOOct 29 00:20schestowitzSay it is an unlawful illegitimate institute.Oct 29 00:20josebut what would be forceOct 29 00:20josewell, “saying” would not be enough by itselfOct 29 00:20schestowitzhave you inventions RECOGNISED and DOCUMENTED elsewhere. That’s what it’s all about, no?Oct 29 00:20joseif you don’t file, i think you lose out on monopoly rightsOct 29 00:21schestowitzPatents are a certificate symbolising some recognition mfor achieving some mental, well… fart.Oct 29 00:21joseofficiall fileOct 29 00:21schestowitzLike emoticons, cookies, and one-click shopping.Oct 29 00:21josecopyrights: auto; patents: not.. leads to the unfairness for fossOct 29 00:21schestowitzOr PgUp/PgDn (key for paging)Oct 29 00:21joseno, the danger is the legal enforcement of monopoliesOct 29 00:22josewe can market that foss innovates, but that is differentOct 29 00:22schestowitzIf you can document ideas in some Wikis as you go along (not just in source code), then maybe you can assert something in the form of a /statement/Oct 29 00:22joseyes, maybe that would be a way forward, but the formality is what adds protection to fightOct 29 00:23schestowitzI think of something else.Oct 29 00:23josebtw, i think the asserting is puke .. it’s all puke..Oct 29 00:23schestowitzTrolls aside, if you can accumulate lists of things an aggressor does but never patented, then you can slam them.. well, verbally to to speak, not with the assistance of US law.Oct 29 00:23josewe may be able to get help from puke dealers if we give incentivesOct 29 00:24joselike that for royalty payment cases,they get a cutOct 29 00:24schestowitzThe only money in patents is bullying and litigation.Oct 29 00:24schestowitzbad name for FOSS..Oct 29 00:24schestowitzLike defending the GPL, but much worse cause you don’t approach with violation of your own CODE.Oct 29 00:25schestowitzJust IDEAS.Oct 29 00:25schestowitzThat said…Oct 29 00:25josecopyright faces same issues except that it is free to acquire and is less broad in scopeOct 29 00:25schestowitzYou are on to something because..Oct 29 00:25schestowitzSome guy from FFII thought about creating his own patent troll to attack Microsoft Office.Oct 29 00:25josethat would help neutralize MicrosoftOct 29 00:25schestowitzYou could set something up.Oct 29 00:25josethat cases exists todayOct 29 00:25josethe issue is will those with the patents play alongOct 29 00:26schestowitzThen buy patents that Office violates and attack Microsoft with them… just to make a statement.Oct 29 00:26schestowitzAs he puts it, “go for removal of product from market” (Microsoft Office)Oct 29 00:26joseright, i’m surprised this hasn’t happened to dateOct 29 00:26schestowitzYes, I know that exists.Oct 29 00:26schestowitzBut if it comes from a troll-like aggressor that’s targeting one of the biggest pro-swpats lobbyinst, then..Oct 29 00:27jose10 patents a month focused on MSO would get the laws changed tout de suiteOct 29 00:27schestowitzlobbyistOct 29 00:27josefighting is costly thoughOct 29 00:27schestowitzFFII might be able to get funding, but I’m not sure.Oct 29 00:27schestowitzYou need to just fish for the right patents but also hire lawyers.Oct 29 00:28josemessy.Oct 29 00:28schestowitzjose: you can just threaten them, no fight.Oct 29 00:28josepuke is messyOct 29 00:28schestowitzLXER has a page too.. hold on.Oct 29 00:28joseyeahOct 29 00:28schestowitzhttp://lxer.com/module/db/viewby.ph…Oct 29 00:28joseso do we need anything further than what we have today?Oct 29 00:28schestowitzPatents Microsoft may be infringing…Oct 29 00:29schestowitz“Patent Region Patent NR TitleOct 29 00:29schestowitzEP 0,689,133 Method of displaying multiple sets of information in the same area of a computer screenOct 29 00:29schestowitzEP 0,195,098 System for reproducing information in material objects at a point of sale locationOct 29 00:29schestowitzUS 6,167,394 Information management system with remote access and display featuresOct 29 00:29schestowitzEP 0,537,100 A method of implementing a preview window in an object oriented programming system”Oct 29 00:29joseso, i’ll repeat:Oct 29 00:30josedo we need anything further than what we have today?Oct 29 00:30joseanyway, that license suggestion may not hurt if done right and it could certainly help put some patents in our cornerOct 29 00:30schestowitzYesOct 29 00:31joseit’s pukaciousOct 29 00:31schestowitzWe need to respond.Oct 29 00:31schestowitzMicrosoft is crumbling and it’ll probably go aggressive directly, or by proxy (IV et al)Oct 29 00:31joseminimum, we should be able to pressure a scenario where all FOSS becomes immune to patents.. though defining the scope of “FOSS” might get trickyOct 29 00:32josewe have the arguments on our side, but we might still need fireOct 29 00:32schestowitzWhat is FOSS?Oct 29 00:33joseto get laws to change as they shouldOct 29 00:33schestowitzA lot of OSS is semi-proprietaryOct 29 00:33josein this case that may not hurtOct 29 00:33schestowitzI’drather limit things to Free software (GPL).Oct 29 00:33josesince the result would be non patent enforcement over anythingOct 29 00:33schestowitzFOSS may not deserve special treatment, but Free software has the political element that’s more vengeful.Oct 29 00:34josei’d rather that gpl not be allowed on closed platforms like windowsOct 29 00:34schestowitzI’ll do a post about it tomorrow.Oct 29 00:34schestowitzAlso on that E-mail.Oct 29 00:34schestowitzMicrosoft is trying to devour FOSSOct 29 00:34schestowitzBlackboard tries the same thing, but that’s another separate story.Oct 29 00:34schestowitzBlackboard is funded (was funded) by MicrosogftOct 29 00:35schestowitzPart of the same toxic waste pretty much..Oct 29 00:35schestowitzThe criminals still snub the EU regulators: http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquire…Oct 29 00:37josethe monopoly provisions of patent laws are too strong.Oct 29 00:38josethis is something that could get watered down, but in a way where foss is still not off the hookOct 29 00:38joseyet we couldn’t stop ms from putting out msoOct 29 00:38josevarious watering down efforts could leave us weakOct 29 00:39schestowitzPublic optnion matters.Oct 29 00:39joseif people were “building and sharing with FOSS”, we would have much more leverageOct 29 00:40schestowitzTo talk about activism for a moment, I mainly read and write stuff.Oct 29 00:40schestowitzI don’t go out to the streets to protest physically.Oct 29 00:40schestowitzBut with awareness comes a wider response and it’s our better change…Oct 29 00:40schestowitzRemember Chris’ “Sue me Fisrt” from last year?Oct 29 00:40josethink soOct 29 00:40josewebsite got taken down rightOct 29 00:41schestowitzIf you show people how ugly a company has become using patent threats, they will naturally die off.Oct 29 00:41schestowitzMicrosoft is said to be gaming many sites to paint itself as a good company. it fools a lot of people. Gates and his bogus ‘Fundation’ too… joint by the press he owns.Oct 29 00:41joseif people don’t use foss and if we don’t have weapons, i think we will have the rules changed so that we are vulnerableOct 29 00:42schestowitzIf people understand who runs the company — “criminals”, depending on who you ask, including sources close to the company — then people will avoid Microsoft.Oct 29 00:42josemany elements within the foss community want to form friendship bonds with msOct 29 00:42josewe can’t even get our own house in orderOct 29 00:43josemoney has influenceOct 29 00:43schestowitz“Sue me First” was actually about people signing up for Microsoft to sue them (for Linux violations). A way of saying Microsoft is BSing.Oct 29 00:43joseyeahOct 29 00:43schestowitzThe system is corrupt too.Oct 29 00:43josememory is refreshedOct 29 00:43schestowitzRMS is spending a lot of his time these days educating people about the umrella that permits abusive monopolisation and corruption.Oct 29 00:44schestowitzThe current economic collapse too is a result of corruption.Oct 29 00:44schestowitzAt the very top level.. imposed by those macro-economists who overlooked the system at a World Bank-level.Oct 29 00:44schestowitzBN has had some successful impact in helping people realise and remember who Microsoft is.Oct 29 00:45schestowitzThat’s what makes Microsofters like Miguel de Icaza so uncomfortable about the site.Oct 29 00:45josebyfield wrote a “neutral” article about BNOct 29 00:45schestowitzhaha.Oct 29 00:46schestowitzDid you see Sam’s article? It took me by surprise.Oct 29 00:46joseand wrote another about rules of engagement but i didn’t read itOct 29 00:46josewhichOct 29 00:46schestowitzBruce just attacked the site. Pillock.Oct 29 00:46schestowitzjose: yes, he told me he would wrOct 29 00:46schestowitzjose: yes, he told me he would write that second article too.Oct 29 00:46schestowitzhttp://www.itwire.com/content/vie…Oct 29 00:47schestowitzMiguel de Icaza called Sam a “Jihadist” IIRC, so he didn’t take that well.Oct 29 00:47schestowitzWhen he saw the Linux.com he must have reacted also as defence for his own side.Oct 29 00:48schestowitzGive it a year, give it twoOct 29 00:48schestowitzWhen the trolls use Mono and other “Free” Posionware to attack GNU/Linux, then they’ll try to deny that people knew in advance.Oct 29 00:48josethe prob with mono isn’t that i will use it. it’s that it could grow to encompass too much and of decent quality (in theory). overall, it would take away resources from the safer and more strategic fossOct 29 00:51schestowitzyes, it’s happening already.Oct 29 00:52schestowitzBanshee, Moonlight, Tomboy…Oct 29 00:52schestowitzThey will sooner or later claim that all the ‘cutting-edge’ apps are using the ‘cutting-edge’ MSMONOOct 29 00:53joseschestowitz, just sent you another (short) email.Oct 29 01:00josethe added reading info is not that short though.. (can skip article if want though it’s kind of interesting)Oct 29 01:00joseno need to read nowOct 29 01:00josethe commentsOct 29 01:01joseroy, the comments may not be that clear, sorry, but ask away if you wantOct 29 01:05schestowitzNo, it’s clear.Oct 29 01:06schestowitzI think that given this documented conversation and the notes, there’s a good post coming.Oct 29 01:06schestowitzI’ll also discuss this with FFII if I get the chance.Oct 29 01:06josei sent you another link (2nd email), but i was looking over that and it isn’t clear at all.. so don’t worryOct 29 01:08joseit’s complicated to explain that projectOct 29 01:09josewithout tangible materialOct 29 01:09schestowitzWhat Free software needs is not just code.Oct 29 01:10schestowitzIt needs protection for the existing stuff too.Oct 29 01:10schestowitzKDE development is already stifled by patents (e.g. Apple stuff)Oct 29 01:10PetoKraus has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))Oct 29 01:27GoblinRFD has quit (“Konversation terminated!”)Oct 29 01:48MinceRgnOct 29 01:50moparx has quit (“leaving”)Oct 29 01:51joseschestowitz, let me add something..Oct 29 01:55schestowitzOKOct 29 01:55josethe incentive to those writing up the patents can existOct 29 01:55josebecause there is a business model of selling propri licenses to third parties that payOct 29 01:56josewhere you own copyrights to say gpl code (so they’d have incentive to pay for special licenses).Oct 29 01:56josethis is where the patent writers can pull in their royalties (even if tiny)Oct 29 01:56joseplus, many would have as an incentive to tap into ms’Oct 29 01:57joseclosed source monopolyOct 29 01:57josepricingOct 29 01:57joseas long as there is closed sourceOct 29 01:57josethere would be potential for royaltiesOct 29 01:57josecause otherwise, you are right, there might be less than zero motivation for almost anyone to do the bulk of writing up a patentOct 29 01:57josei can even see law and engineering students contributingOct 29 01:58schestowitzWhat about trolls?Oct 29 01:58josewhat specifically?.. you mean our protection from them?Oct 29 01:58josewell, a shell corp might be safe if they don’t use closed software for very muchOct 29 01:58josebut we can go after those owning a stake in such companiesOct 29 01:59josewe’d neutralize ms at leastOct 29 01:59joseie, if you own a stake in a company that attacks, you lose your protections for the software you useOct 29 01:59josethen trolls would be isolatedOct 29 02:00jose rather than be leveraged as the loophole they represent today for getting around gpl3 or whateverOct 29 02:00joseif it is MAD for enough people laws can changeOct 29 02:00josewill changeOct 29 02:00josebut we want protection from what they might be changed toOct 29 02:01joseif possibleOct 29 02:01josei don’t like puke, but this might simply be an extra toolOct 29 02:01joseand puke sweepers might handle the dirty work for usOct 29 02:01josewe’d benefit and they would tooOct 29 02:01josetrolls could always be a problem, but by themselves, laws would change i thinkOct 29 02:02joseanyway, the best part is that the license would set up the framework .. it would create a lot of food for those that want to play the patent game.. but with FOSS safe in proportion to more participating to gather up that food.. i mean pukeOct 29 02:03josei thinkOct 29 02:03schestowitzWill you market is as P.U.K.E.?Oct 29 02:07joseMAD fro PUKEOct 29 02:08josePUKEsOct 29 02:08schestowitzI still think that trolls can only be made toothless and clawless through systenmwide changes.Oct 29 02:08josethis may help accel to that point while giving us strength along the way and creating something that can counter ms more effectively in the meantimeOct 29 02:08joseyou are right that this would have to be marketedOct 29 02:09schestowitzWho will sign up and based on what premise/promise?Oct 29 02:09joseWell, today, you can’t come up with a patent unless you invent.. this would open up a framework allowing you to patent what you see in exchange for immunity and maybe even giving the project a perce cut of royalties taken against closed sourceOct 29 02:10joseof course, most patents are bogusOct 29 02:10joseok, maybe we can add something about retaining rights to also use the patentsOct 29 02:11joseit would be co-owned so that any party could use itOct 29 02:11joseotherwise, ms would leverage this and not sue itself, etcOct 29 02:11joseno that didn’t make senseOct 29 02:11josethere are details to be ironed out for sureOct 29 02:12schestowitzIt sounds like OInOct 29 02:12joseallowing offensive use would attract puke sweepersOct 29 02:12schestowitzThat’s of no use.Oct 29 02:12schestowitzWell, as phrased above anywayOct 29 02:12josewe’d have coverage for all fossOct 29 02:12joseinstead of just linux or some limited setOct 29 02:13josebut what is “all foss”?Oct 29 02:13josedetails detailsOct 29 02:13joseif it was like oin, it would be different in that contributions would projects could be used by patents created by others because of co-ownershipOct 29 02:14joseor rather, the inventor would get the patentOct 29 02:14josebut with an auto license that the ones writing it up would get access to royalty fees — that would be their incentiveOct 29 02:15josethe inventors have to be the patent owners i think based on us patent lawOct 29 02:15josedetailsOct 29 02:15josethis wayOct 29 02:15joseprior artOct 29 02:15josewould not just be useful in court to refute attacking patentsOct 29 02:15josebut could actually be seized ahead of time to create a patent for usOct 29 02:15schestowitzFrom trolls too?Oct 29 02:16schestowitzMicrosoft could use its proxies.Oct 29 02:16schestowitzAlthough it becomes too transparentOct 29 02:16schestowitzIf Microsoft attacked from IV, it would be too obvious.Oct 29 02:16schestowitzSo the proxy, much like some exposed lobbying arms, is rendered useless.Oct 29 02:16schestowitzSCO comes to mindOct 29 02:16josewell, that is why i mentioned that the auto protection would extend to users that did not attack or own interests (define?) in attackersOct 29 02:16joseso all foss users would gain license unless you attacked (like existing clauses)Oct 29 02:17josethis is a little confusing now hold onOct 29 02:17joseok, you see an inventionOct 29 02:17josethat falls as contribution under this licenseOct 29 02:18joseyou write up a patent which would be filed under the inventor(s) nameOct 29 02:18joseyou auto get access rights to royaltiesOct 29 02:18joseroyalties to what?Oct 29 02:18josewell, all “foss” users would be immune from royalties unless they violated as just stated (eg, ownership in troll)Oct 29 02:19josealso, closed source software users would not get an auto license but would have to deal with the person that has those rightsOct 29 02:19josesome amount of royalties would be reserved for the project/inventorOct 29 02:19josethe writer would get the restOct 29 02:20josethe inventor would also be able to seek royalties in case the writer didn’t (eg, to neutralize ms)Oct 29 02:20joseremember, foss users and devs are safe if they don’t attack or own trollsOct 29 02:20joseclosed source and violators would be subject to having to license (probably for royalties)Oct 29 02:21schestowitzI’ll need to think about it.Oct 29 02:21josethis would be a direct and immediate way to combat Microsoft’s closed source supported monopoliesOct 29 02:21schestowitzWhat about Apple?Oct 29 02:22josewe might have a clause to deal with the agpl effectOct 29 02:22joseapple would need licenses sureOct 29 02:22joseand the patent writer or the inventors could come after appleOct 29 02:22joseif apple does the closed source thing.. which they do todayOct 29 02:22joseanyway, so this would be a direct weapon against the powerful closed source monopoliesOct 29 02:23josefoss safeOct 29 02:23joseand the royalties incentive would get many patent writers quickly to our sideOct 29 02:23josebuilding strategic patents and patents useful to bring closed source monopolies down quickerOct 29 02:24joseand the foss devs would for the most part do nothing different than what they have been doingOct 29 02:24josecodingOct 29 02:24schestowitzIt’s more important to kill the FUDOct 29 02:24schestowitzMicrosoft won’t sue quite soon, but it’ll use extortion.Oct 29 02:24joseand maybe helping out a bit with the patent.. since they know they might get some moneyOct 29 02:24schestowitzPressure on vendors like Red Hat and fear in customers’ minds.Oct 29 02:25josethis gives us a larger amount of defensive FUDOct 29 02:25schestowitzYesOct 29 02:25josered hat could say, yeah, but ms violates 2000 patentsOct 29 02:25josethat where we have a license and they don’tOct 29 02:25josethe pressure would more quickly mount to use open source (defined?)Oct 29 02:26josenot shared source, btwOct 29 02:26joseand this would help tackle the monopoly issue that the antitrust auth have been powerless against for so longOct 29 02:26josems cannot sustain their effectiveness if they go open sourceOct 29 02:27joseand if they will use monopoly money against us, we might as well get a cutOct 29 02:27joseOct 29 02:27joseI’m getting simply MAD about thisOct 29 02:27schestowitzRed Hat already has OINOct 29 02:27josePatents U Kan EnheritOct 29 02:27josei know that’s badOct 29 02:27schestowitzI’m just a little tired (2:30AM)Oct 29 02:28joseawful actuallyOct 29 02:28josei have to go tooOct 29 02:28schestowitzWe should continue this tomorrow.Oct 29 02:28schestowitzgnOct 29 02:28josemaybe tomorrow it will make more senseOct 29 02:28josegnOct 29 02:28joserh has oin.. this would be a framework that could be used to grow oin faster and larger.. it could also end up giving foss projects royaltiesOct 29 02:29josei know who’d thunk i’d be talking about royalties to foss projects when we are such enemies of patentsOct 29 02:30joseusing patent law against them.. by leveraging numbers, we could show how useless and unfair the system isOct 29 02:30joseremember, today, patents are built separately not in collaborationOct 29 02:30joseand the inventors frequently don’t participate, losing out on an opportunity for oin defense for exampleOct 29 02:31josesince in us law at least, the inventor must be the one to fileOct 29 02:31joseit’s adding lubrication to the systemOct 29 02:31joseleveraging foss for patents as we already do for copyrightsOct 29 02:32josefoss community that isOct 29 02:32josethe bottom line is that if we are going to be attacked by patents, and if we can leverage our numbers to give ourselves more leverage, and if a byproduct could mean that attackers like microsoft/”interop” are more quickly neutralized, and if in the process foss projects and inventors might gain some money, and we’d get patent writers on our side, then maybe we should seize the opOct 29 02:34joseroy, if we find a way to really tilt the system to our side, then all of those with ideas working on ways to marginalize foss will lose their appetite and have to agree with us or at least go back to the drawing boardOct 29 02:38josegreasing the wheels of patent collaboration can help take us from a weak number (eg) 8 position right to the top of the raceOct 29 02:39joseAND we can give the writers protection themselvesOct 29 02:40josethis would get a bunch more patent contributions for foss, eg, from ibm and othersOct 29 02:41josethey would have incentives to participate on our defense as much as possible, else someone else scoop up the opportunity and charge them a fee later on.Oct 29 02:41joseie, patent writers that participated could get some protection for their own closed source products.. ah, nevermind, this would offer strong monopolies a way to get out of thisOct 29 02:42josedetails details detailsOct 29 02:42jose???Oct 29 02:42josenote that we are not penalizing commercial foss as ms is doing (eg, red hat and others). we’d be charging for those that would keep around their closed source monopolies.. which would have given them monopoly pricing powerOct 29 02:46josethis is pretty much how dual licensing is used sometimes: stay foss and you are fine, or go closed but pay a fee.Oct 29 02:47joseimagine if foss devs, rather than merely producing prior art, could end up in a partnership to make royalties from closed source, while someone else does the dirty work (in exchange for some rights)…Oct 29 02:49josethat is a fairer deal to our devs.. less like the patent equiv of public domain that exists today and instead be more like the gpl which has teethOct 29 02:50jose has quit (“Leaving”)Oct 29 02:52jose (n=jose@adsl-233-170-93.mia.bellsouth.net) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 03:11joseroy, the great idea went down in flamesOct 29 03:11josemad means you don’t attackOct 29 03:11joseif we did, then foss would have problemsOct 29 03:11josewhich means no pressure against closed sourceOct 29 03:11josewell, it would maybe if the company didn’t have patentsOct 29 03:12josewithout the royalty incentive (eg, from a big fish like ms), then patent writers would have few motivations i thinkOct 29 03:12josewhatever.. tomorrow i’m busy almost the entire day but maybe something else will come up.. the concept of collaborating on patents might still be useful.Oct 29 03:14joseeg, if the costs aren’t too high, people might still want to contribute for free since this would give us a concrete weapon as a hedge (stronger than simply prior art)Oct 29 03:15josegnOct 29 03:16jose has quit (“Leaving”)Oct 29 03:16libervisco has quit (“Remember, remember the fifth of november…”)Oct 29 03:18dsmith_ has quit (Remote closed the connection)Oct 29 05:25MinceRgeekingsOct 29 08:43GoblinRFD (n=tim@78-86-75-104.zone2.bethere.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 09:11GoblinRFD has quit (“Konversation terminated!”)Oct 29 09:53tessier makes a submission to /.Oct 29 10:09schestowitzWhich one?Oct 29 10:09PetoKraus (n=Peter@cpc4-broo2-0-0-cust1012.renf.cable.ntl.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 10:11tessierWhich one what?Oct 29 10:12tessierWhich /.?Oct 29 10:12schestowitzHeh. No, what story?Oct 29 10:12tessierOh….the little known story of the downfall of LinspireOct 29 10:12schestowitzAre you still in touch with Robert?Oct 29 10:12tessierMichael Robertson?Oct 29 10:12tessierhttp://kevincarmony.blogspot.com/2008/1…Oct 29 10:12schestowitzOops. yes.Oct 29 10:13schestowitzHehe. Let me see.Oct 29 10:13tessierNo, I’ve never really been “in touch” with him. I never liked the guy. Real asshole.Oct 29 10:13tessierAlthough I have his email and he and I are both on an mp3-alumni mailing list where all of us former employees still chat about stuff.Oct 29 10:13tessierI had a couple potential opportunities to work for him again but I’ve always passed, even when I was hurting for work.Oct 29 10:14schestowitzWhat a mess.Oct 29 10:14tessierWow, past 3am. I gotta be at work in almost 5 hours. Time to sleep. night!Oct 29 10:14schestowitzGNOct 29 10:14schestowitzIceland seeks aid from ECB, Fed; hikes interest rate to 18 pct Oct 29 11:03schestowitzHow predictable… “More Election Shenanigans – Check Your Registration NOW” Oct 29 11:06libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 11:29libervisco has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))Oct 29 11:58schestowitzFunny cartoon : http://vistasucks.files.wordpress.com/20…Oct 29 11:59MinceR:>Oct 29 12:04schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/20… “With just a week to go before the US presidential election, academics, politicians, and voters are voicing increased distrust of the electronic voting machines that will be used to cast ballots.”Oct 29 12:05schestowitzAmazing!! “Stevens faces a maximum of 35 years in prison. But he’s a Senator. So nobody is actually expecting any jail time.” . This system is corrupted beyond belief.Oct 29 12:08PetoKraus has quit (“The purpose of IRC is to…IDLE…”)Oct 29 12:10PetoKraus (n=Peter@cpc4-broo2-0-0-cust1012.renf.cable.ntl.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 12:10schestowitzhttp://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.ph… “Bruce your ability to offend people and then disingenuously crying wolf does not amuse… “Oct 29 12:11schestowitz‘This was a common trick by Rob Enderle [...] Back in the anti-trust trial/sco trial days; put out something that is nothing more than flame-bait and then cries of “poor me” or worse “those open-source meanies”.’Oct 29 12:11schestowitzhttp://www.linuxtoday.com/news_st…Oct 29 12:11schestowitz‘ Ah brucy [...] He must be torqued off about the backlash from his boycott-novell article on Linux.com. Here’s news for you bruce: It’s not just FOSS.’Oct 29 12:12schestowitz“The fact is the FOSS community is a community plagued by fears; fears about Microsoft, sellout Linux vendors, patent trolls, SCO, Apple, you name it. And when people get afraid, they get irrational, and everyone starts looking suspicious.”Oct 29 12:12libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 12:14PetoKraus has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Oct 29 13:05PetoKraus (n=Peter@cpc4-broo2-0-0-cust1012.renf.cable.ntl.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 13:05PetoKraus has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Oct 29 13:11PetoKraus (n=Peter@cpc4-broo2-0-0-cust1012.renf.cable.ntl.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 13:12libervisco has quit (Remote closed the connection)Oct 29 13:23twitter see there? you did not have to write anything about BB at all.Oct 29 14:30twitterThe last quote gets it backward. It would be irrational to not be suspicious of unrepentant, convicted felons like M$. They are powerful, so it takes real bravery to call them out.Oct 29 14:32trmanco (n=trmanco@bl8-237-133.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 14:36mib_nmor4y (i=cbad29be@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-4b15ee0b881407fc) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 15:13mib_nmor4y has quit (Client Quit)Oct 29 15:14*_Doug (n=_Doug) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 15:17_DougHow to track a teenager hacker Oct 29 15:18_Doug01. Go on social networksOct 29 15:18_Doug02. Go on YoutubeOct 29 15:18_Doug03. Go to the hacker websiteOct 29 15:18_Doughttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi…Oct 29 15:18_DougOct 29 15:18schestowitzHeyOct 29 15:21_Doughey dude are u a hak0r Oct 29 15:22_Dougshoosh .. don’t tell anyone on Facebook :]Oct 29 15:22_Dougwhat’s missing from this ‘report’ is the computing ecosystem all these hacks run on …Oct 29 15:23schestowitz“Ecosystem” is a bad word… like “blogosphere” it should be loathed.Oct 29 15:24schestowitzEcosystem is what I call shillcosystem. It’s a grouping of vested interests.Oct 29 15:25_Doughacksystem ?Oct 29 15:25_Doughackosystem ??Oct 29 15:25_Doug“Bosses must stop leaving data security to the “IT boys” and other staff and take responsibility themselves”Oct 29 15:26_Doughttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_po…Oct 29 15:26_DougIt’s the bosses that are the source of the problem ..Oct 29 15:26_Dougif they let the ‘IT boys’ do their job, then their wouldn’t be all these data lossesOct 29 15:27schestowitzOh, I see…Oct 29 15:27_Douglike leaving MI5 secret laptops on the trainOct 29 15:27schestowitzSo you’re referring to non-technical people who have a hardon for Exchcnge?Oct 29 15:27_Dougwho in their right mind walks around with confidential datas on a laptop, on a USN key, or posts it through the Rayal MAil ???? !!!!!!Oct 29 15:28schestowitzOr people who choose technology based on brochures and “someone to point a finger at” when things go awry?Oct 29 15:28schestowitzA hacker. Oct 29 15:28schestowitzcracker, sorryOct 29 15:28_Dougquote: ‘Windows 2000 has X zillion of lines’Oct 29 15:29schestowitzFrom the video?Oct 29 15:29_DougI have to sit there while some brain dead CIO reads me out loud from PC world ..Oct 29 15:29schestowitzWell, it’s the BeebOct 29 15:29schestowitzFrom the media channel that says transistors are tiny computersOct 29 15:29_Dougno, thast quote is from real life ..Oct 29 15:29schestowitzIDG?Oct 29 15:30schestowitzPCWorld?Oct 29 15:30schestowitzThey are IDG (IDC), you know?Oct 29 15:30schestowitzWintel press, funded partly by Microsoft through studies and all…Oct 29 15:30_DougIt was how they described the power of W2K, in terms of number of lines ..Oct 29 15:30_DougHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAOct 29 15:30_DougIt was how they described the power of W2K to the pointy haired ones, in terms of number of linesOct 29 15:31schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/06/…Oct 29 15:31_Dougthat’s how they vost programmers, in terms of number of lines they can bang out per hour ..Oct 29 15:32_Doug‘they cost’Oct 29 15:32schestowitzYes.Oct 29 15:32schestowitzSo if someone removes many bugs, the measurable progress is low.Oct 29 15:33schestowitzhttp://www.thisisby.us/index.php/con…Oct 29 15:34benJIman_Doug: Noone sensible does.Oct 29 15:34benJImanGood programmers often have a negative line count per hour.Oct 29 15:34_Dougit’s just a metric they come up with thet the PHB would understand .. lines of code .. good grief ..Oct 29 15:35_Doug.. LINES OF CODE ..Oct 29 15:35_Doug‘How to track a teenaged hacker’ .. they call this hacking .. more like scribbling graffiti on a wall ..Oct 29 15:37twitterW2K source code, “we are morons” http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2…Oct 29 15:37twittershow that to the boss.Oct 29 15:37_Dougand no mention of the root cause of the ‘hacking’ phishing virus infestation ..Oct 29 15:37_Dougthis is all so 1993 .. Oct 29 15:38_Doughttp://www.imdb.com/title/tt0107048/Oct 29 15:38_DougClippy is having the worst day of his life … over and over again ..Oct 29 15:39twitterPoor choice of software by ill informed decisions is the only thing you should blame the user for in security problems.Oct 29 15:39_Dougand who chooses the software .. not the IT ‘boys’ to be sure ..Oct 29 15:39twitterFor example, users should not have to worry about lost data on portable devices if the device is encrypted.Oct 29 15:39_Dougsome fucking idiot who believes the ability to read makes him qualified to make IT related decisions ..Oct 29 15:40twitterSure, M$ based decisions come from the top, like the London stock exchange fiasco.Oct 29 15:40schestowitzOct 29 15:40schestowitzThe ‘IT boys’ chose Vistaserver for stock markets?Oct 29 15:40schestowitzThat’s begging for a black screen of you-know-whatOct 29 15:41twitterBegging for a Black Tuesday.Oct 29 15:41twitterahhh!Oct 29 15:41_DougI don’t think so .. the management consultants choos it, most probably ..Oct 29 15:41schestowitzFurse?Oct 29 15:42twitterThe person who chose M$ for the LSE was not an IT person nor qualified to make the decision.Oct 29 15:42twitterThe proof is in the performance.Oct 29 15:42schestowitzFurse should not resign, she should be sacked : http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/09…Oct 29 15:43schestowitzLondon Stock Exchange in denial over system outage : http://www.computerworlduk.com/management/it-bu…Oct 29 15:43twitterJust the same, we should not blame the user for nasty breaches of security. Decision makers and M$ are to blame for the most part.Oct 29 15:43schestowitzThe LSE has crashes many times since then… but not in the technical sense.Oct 29 15:43schestowitzFTSE is back up today… above 4000Oct 29 15:43schestowitzAbout those Windows Live Messenger outages… : http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=1585Oct 29 15:44_Dougwho was it that one said the Internet was to important to be left to the propellerheads ?Oct 29 15:45_Doug“To be sure, the CIO (not on the board) is ex-Accenture man David Lester”Oct 29 15:46schestowitzWho said “Let’s face it, the average computer user has the brain of a Spider Monkey”?Oct 29 15:46_Dougwell that explains it ..Oct 29 15:46_Dougif you want to kill an IT project hire on EDS and Accenture to run it ..Oct 29 15:46twitterI’ll be happy if we don’t suffer a depression over a few companies that deserve to fail. I just don’t see how it can be avoided with the current concentration of wealth and all the factories being in China.Oct 29 15:46_Doughave EDS and Accenture bid to run Chimas IT infrastructure, Oct 29 15:47schestowitzMoto headcount… ? “Sanjay Jha, co-CEO at Motorola, is planning another round of layoffs in the mobile division as the group struggles to reduce the range of supported platforms from the existing 15 to something a little more manageable.” http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/…Oct 29 15:47schestowitzAt least they are joining Android.Oct 29 15:47schestowitzConvergence at last. They can bring their stack parts to OHA.Oct 29 15:48schestowitzThere was an article in El Reg about the NHS failure the other day.Oct 29 15:48schestowitzTheir wasting of like 12 billion pounds could save some banks, no?Oct 29 15:48schestowitzPrivacy bomb: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/1…Oct 29 15:49_Dougluckly most perscription medicines has no effect ..Oct 29 15:50_DougOct 29 15:50schestowitzLinks dump for old news.. http://www.internetling.com/2008/10/28/50-resour… … any use for just that, unless it’s all news?Oct 29 15:53schestowitzHOWTOs too…. who actually looks for very specific HOWTOs among the news, just because they are newly-published?Oct 29 15:53twitterHere’s an ongoing troll fest. http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1010345 Dedazo and Macthorpe are the same person. It’s funny to watch him try to outbid himself as the biggest troll.Oct 29 15:55schestowitzBN is going to surpass 100 GB of traffic tomorrow… for October.Oct 29 15:55twitterOct 29 15:55schestowitzWhy do they bother.Oct 29 15:56schestowitzShills4shilsOct 29 15:56schestowitzDefend the other dunces uv’ the emporer.Oct 29 15:56_Doug“If you change tabs To spaces, you will be killed doing so fucks the build process!”Oct 29 15:56schestowitzemperorOct 29 15:56_Doug“ACHTUNG!!! this is a special hack for IBM antivirus software”Oct 29 15:57twitterThey are the same person, obviously. I wonder if AlexGr is the same person too. Maybe BB. Who knows?Oct 29 15:57_Doug‘CallProc32W is insane. It’s a variadic function that uses the pascal calling convention. (It probably makes more sense when you’re stoned.)’Oct 29 15:58MinceRwindows?Oct 29 15:59schestowitzMicrosoft Response to Zsulik’s Comments : http://slashdot.org/comme…Oct 29 15:59schestowitzWhat is he like, a spokesman for Redmond now?Oct 29 15:59schestowitzLOL http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2… “By Peter galli”Oct 29 15:59schestowitzGalli is now a Microsoft employeeOct 29 15:59schestowitzHe used to do their dirty jobs in the press (Ziff/Gates)Oct 29 16:00schestowitzControversy Swirls Around Changes in GPLv3 [...] By Peter GalliOct 29 16:00schestowitzIt would be nice to see a nice list of eWeek articles from (now) Microsoft employee Peyte GalliOct 29 16:01schestowitzHe threw a lot of FUD.Oct 29 16:01schestowitzhttp://www.eweek.com/c/a/Linux-and-Open-Sou… “But ACT (the Association for Competitive Technology), which has previously been accused of being an association founded and cultivated solely to protect Microsofts interests in Washington, views the issue differently.”Oct 29 16:03twitterNasty little trolls don’t like being exposed.Oct 29 16:03twitterha haOct 29 16:03schestowitzNice one, Pete. Quoting a Microsoft shill arm/pressure group… . If you have time, it’s worth studying these ‘moles’ http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09… http://boycottnovell.com/2007/12/04/…Oct 29 16:04_Doug“UBERSOFT. We Patent, So You Can’t”Oct 29 16:16_Doughttp://www.groklaw.net/article…Oct 29 16:16schestowitzUK’s £12.7 billion NHS scheme in trouble : http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inqui…Oct 29 16:16schestowitzThis is the third one in recent days… http://www.ubersoft.net/comic/hd/… http://www.ubersoft.net/comic/hd/200…Oct 29 16:18schestowitz“Currently the only thing saving the project is the high cost of cancelling contracts with IT suppliers. In other words, the government has wasted so much dosh already, it might as well try to plug in the lemon.”Oct 29 16:19ChanServ has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32MinceR has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32benJIman has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32PetoKraus has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32logger_bot has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32twitter has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32*_Doug has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32trmanco has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32[H]omer has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32tessier has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32pombat42 has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)Oct 29 16:32*[H]omer (n=[H]omer@moscow.perfect-privacy.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36*_Doug (n=_Doug@ip-217-204-51-230.easynet.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36_Dougonly a geek would understand this ‘void initRand();’ as a random link ..Oct 29 16:19_Doughttp://www.ubersoft.net/void-initrandOct 29 16:19_Dougonly it isn’t Oct 29 16:19_Doug“the only thing saving the project” .. the Titanic defense .. if we keep going fast enough, we won’t hit an iceberg Oct 29 16:20trmanco (n=trmanco@bl8-237-133.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36PetoKraus (n=Peter@cpc4-broo2-0-0-cust1012.renf.cable.ntl.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36pombat42 (n=pombat42@ool-182dda9f.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36tessier (n=treed@kernel-panic/sex-machines) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36twitter (n=willhill@ip24-250-67-51.br.br.cox.net) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36benJIman (n=benji@benjiweber.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36MinceR (n=mincer@unaffiliated/mincer) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36logger_bot (n=roy@baine.smb.man.ac.uk) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 16:36irc.freenode.net gives channel operator status to [H]omer ChanServOct 29 16:36Received a CTCP VERSION from freenode-connectOct 29 16:36_DougAndroid flaw due to use of Open Source components say security researchers ..Oct 29 16:56_Doug“The vulnerability is due to the fact Google did not use the most up-to-date versions of all these packages,”Oct 29 16:56_Doughttp://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/news/22291…Oct 29 16:56_Doug“Because Android relies on some 80 different open-source components, keeping track of security disclosures and bug fixes could prove difficult, potentially leaving the platform open to future attacks”Oct 29 16:56twitter12.7 billion pounds? does it really cost that much to sftp dicom files?Oct 29 16:57schestowitzIt’s more than that.Oct 29 16:57twitterBecause M$ depends on hundreds of different secret source components, keeping track of anything has proved difficult.Oct 29 16:58twitter “In other words, this particular security vulnerability that affects the G1 phone was known and fixed in the relevant software package, but Google used an older, still vulnerable version.” ick, if true.Oct 29 17:00twitterI’m having a hard time getting through the clueless parts.Oct 29 17:00MinceRi wonder how distros manage to keep track of security disclosures and bug fixes thenOct 29 17:00MinceRoh wait, they do it better than microsoft ever has.Oct 29 17:00_Doug’12.7 billion’ ? wha ?Oct 29 17:01schestowitzBoycott Novell…Big in Japan… http://sourceforge.jp/magazine/0…Oct 29 17:01twitterIt’s funny how M$ uses the poor security record to tar other companies.Oct 29 17:01twittercool, but I have no idea what they are saying.Oct 29 17:02twitterDoug, see Roy’s NHS link. http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/ne…Oct 29 17:03schestowitzThe number has been out for like a year.Oct 29 17:03schestowitztwitter: I have no idea even what /I/ am said to be saying. I don’t really speak Japanese.Oct 29 17:04schestowitzI installed Skype this morning. it’s embarrassing.Oct 29 17:05MinceRseems to be signed by Byfield thoughOct 29 17:05twitterhttp://babelfish.yahoo.com/transla…Oct 29 17:06twitterSorry to hear about skype problems.Oct 29 17:06MinceRlooks like a translation of an article someone has already linked here.Oct 29 17:07twitterGnome netmeeting became Ekigia (sp). KDE’s chat has web cam stuff but not for all protocols.Oct 29 17:07_Doug“Quite, like whether you do not know the fatigue of, Schestowitz “Oct 29 17:07_DougOct 29 17:07schestowitztwitter: no, there’s no problem. But I’ve avoided Skype cause it’s proprietary. This time I have no choice cause the phone system is dysfunctional.Oct 29 17:08schestowitztwitter: I checked Ekiga the other day. The Windows client (for peers) is still in Beta, so…Oct 29 17:08MinceRskype isn’t merely proprietaryOct 29 17:08MinceRit’s a black boxOct 29 17:09schestowitz_Doug: is that the translation?Oct 29 17:09MinceRi’d go as far as to call it spywareOct 29 17:09schestowitzYes, I know.Oct 29 17:09schestowitzSurveillance on phones is the same though… it’s a black box too.Oct 29 17:09_Dougtranslation, yesOct 29 17:09schestowitzTop-priority projects list from the FSF includes a Skype substitute.Oct 29 17:10twitterThe translation is just as verbose as BB native, but it makes a little more sense that way.Oct 29 17:10schestowitzGovts. /LOVE/ SkypeOct 29 17:10schestowitzThey must be getting back doors to it.Oct 29 17:10schestowitzThere\s evidence abound.Oct 29 17:10twitter Boycott Novell has expressed “great crack is borne”Oct 29 17:10schestowitzAnd in China the Govt. stalks the textual chats, based on word triggers.Oct 29 17:10twitterChina has that cute little cartoon cop to make sure people don’t use dirty words like freedom.Oct 29 17:11schestowitzHaha.Oct 29 17:12schestowitzYes, I know that one.Oct 29 17:12schestowitzhttp://images.google.com/images?um=1&am…Oct 29 17:13schestowitzNovell boosted with its OOo fork.. http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/…Oct 29 17:15twittera little too real for me http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/i…Oct 29 17:19schestowitzArticles like this absolutely FLOOOOODED the news. Why is it so newsworthy? We didn’t hear when the other companies joined. Did /. push this agenda too? ‘Open’ Microsoft?Oct 29 17:21_DougOther members of the AMQP Working Group include Cisco, Credit Suisse, Deutsche Boerse Systems, Envoy Technologies Inc., The Goldman Sachs Group, iMatix, IONA Technologies, J.P. Morgan, Novell, Rabbit Technologies Ltd., Red Hat Inc., TWIST Process Innovations Ltd., WSO2 and 29West Inc ..Oct 29 17:22schestowitzHas RMS ever traveled to China? I know he was afraid of Russia,Oct 29 17:22_DougLook who isn’t there .. about two only software companies ..Oct 29 17:22twitterEWeek Articles by Peter Golly Golly 4/24 of this year. http://www.eweek.com/cp/bio/Peter-Galli/Oct 29 17:22schestowitz_Doug: yes, not a word about it. Then Microsoft joins and the news is FLOODED by praises for the Vole.Oct 29 17:22_DougIONA .. used to be big in online commerce solutions ..Oct 29 17:23_Dougsorry, three software companies, MS, Novell and Red Hat ..Oct 29 17:24schestowitztwitter: lots of Microsoft stuff. Hardly ever critical at all.Oct 29 17:24twitterYeah, but they end on 4/24. Missed the word end above, my bad.Oct 29 17:25schestowitzMS agenda-pushing: portuno_diamo: http://www.microsoft-watch.com/content/corpor…Oct 29 17:26schestowitzSomeone warned me about that ” portuno_diamo” character the other dayOct 29 17:26schestowitzhttp://www.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-and-Wireless/I… … Just like OLPC… shoot first, then pretend to have apologised. Intel’s gangster-like behaviour is still being concealed being logos and images.Oct 29 17:31_Dougnotice how being rebuffed by Yahoo was another good stratigic decision on behalf of MS .. they’re right even when they’re wrong Oct 29 17:32_Doug“Matters would be different had Microsoft bought Yahoo during late first quarter .. Instead, Microsoft is flush with cashOct 29 17:33_Doug“Oct 29 17:33_Dougbut they had to borrow to finance the3 Yahoo takeover .. and the bid still isn’t over ..Oct 29 17:34_Doug“perhaps ironically, the economy will do for Microsoft what it couldn’t competitively: Eliminate troublesome Web 2.0 platform companies”Oct 29 17:34twitterportuno_diamo is that guy for real? Is Joe Wilcox for real? Clueless.Oct 29 17:34twitterM$, ignoring the internet since 1995.Oct 29 17:35twitterThat’s a competitive advantage.Oct 29 17:35_Dougexplain what magic sauce MS lives on that it is immune to the economic downturn ..Oct 29 17:35twitterWORD.DOC, ha haOct 29 17:35_Doug“The economic blight will kill many trees in the forest. Microsoft will replace them.”Oct 29 17:35twitterGoogle and ODF sail along.Oct 29 17:35twitterWindows market share must be falling by now.Oct 29 17:36twitterI visited LSU’s Student Union yesterday. Every other laptop was a Mac.Oct 29 17:36twitterZero Vista seen.Oct 29 17:37schestowitztwitter: it does (market share falls)Oct 29 17:37_DougMicrosoft slugs aged care centres ..Oct 29 17:38_Doughttp://www.australianit.news.com.au/s…Oct 29 17:38twitterWilcox sez, ” Microsoft couldn’t be bringing its cloud services to market at a better time. For many cash-strapped businesses, hosted versions of Exchange, SharePoint and other Microsoft server software will be hugely appealing, particularly when reducing staff and management costs. “Oct 29 17:39moparx (n=moparx@pdpc/supporter/base/moparx) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 17:39twitterWhat a moron. There are plenty of email providers, including google.Oct 29 17:39schestowitzYesOct 29 17:39schestowitzThe site is biased though.Oct 29 17:39_Dougwhy will ‘the cloud’ be more sucessfull than Google Apps ?Oct 29 17:40twitterIt’s also a huge FU to MSCEsOct 29 17:40schestowitzBecause the Slog sez soOct 29 17:40twitterfailOct 29 17:40_Doug“tried, true and supported commercial software matters more when times are tough”Oct 29 17:40schestowitzLOLOct 29 17:40schestowitzAnd rain is good… well, for the gardenOct 29 17:40twitterthen he suggests moving to new untried commercial softwareOct 29 17:41schestowitzClouds are dangerousOct 29 17:41_Doug“Microsoft Releases Emergency Critical Patch” http://www.crn.com/security/211600229Oct 29 17:41_DougOct 29 17:41schestowitzRemember DRM/MSN shop for music?Oct 29 17:41twitterhalf his success companies are web 1.0 survivors.Oct 29 17:41schestowitzShut downOct 29 17:41schestowitzMusic deadOct 29 17:41schestowitzThe Register had something… waitOct 29 17:41schestowitz“When you hit the quota…it’s possible we will block access to your site,” Microsoft’s Manuvir Das told PDC after a session, Lap Around Windows Azure. Das did try to reassure potential developers blocking was not guaranteed, but noted: “We have the capability to do that and may have to do that.” Oct 29 17:42PetoKraushaha beranger Oct 29 17:42schestowitzWhat did he do this time?Oct 29 17:43PetoKrausit happened to me once; we didn’t mention a guy for about a half a yearOct 29 17:43PetoKrausand it turned out he read the logs of the channelOct 29 17:43PetoKrausbut was afraid to come inOct 29 17:43PetoKrausand the day he was mentioned, he actually came in to defend himselfOct 29 17:43schestowitzWho’s that?Oct 29 17:44PetoKrauspoor old sod, reading trough heaps of rubbishOct 29 17:44schestowitzNovell employees sometimes come here.Oct 29 17:44PetoKrausBeranger reminded me of thisOct 29 17:44PetoKrausBeranger: come in, don’t worry, you may as well say something useful!Oct 29 17:44_DougbenJIman .. wassup ?Oct 29 17:44PetoKraus(http://beranger.org/index.php?page=dia…)Oct 29 17:44schestowitzLOLOct 29 17:45PetoKraustouche, i sayOct 29 17:46_Dougot: see ‘Joe the Plumber’ work his brain ..Oct 29 17:52_Doughttp://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vFC9jv9jfoAOct 29 17:52_Dougand ‘Joe the Plumber’ isn’t really a plumber Oct 29 17:52PetoKrausit’s a fake.Oct 29 17:53PetoKrausobviouslyOct 29 17:53PetoKrausfrom the first glimpse.Oct 29 17:54PetoKrausi just don’t know whether McCain or Obama hired himOct 29 17:54_DougI suspected that as well .. Joes is just too primed .. it’s just he has no real come-back to Obama ..Oct 29 17:54PetoKrausi ain’t suspecting. I am sure. the moment you see high school girl students posting pro-obama posts on facebookOct 29 17:55PetoKrausyou pretty much don’t believe anything is real.Oct 29 17:55_Doug“Joe the Plumber is now Joe the foreign policy advisor?”Oct 29 17:57_Doughttp://features.csmonitor.com/politics/2008/…Oct 29 17:57_DougIS this a spoof ?Oct 29 17:57schestowitzStill a few days left for dirty tricks.Oct 29 17:57schestowitzThe McCain video I posted made it into FSDaily’s front page,Oct 29 17:58schestowitzHere’s something I don’t get. Microsoft unveiled Web-based Office years ago (almost 2)… and it failed to attract user by its own admission.. they they remake old news… http://www.pcworld.com/articl…Oct 29 18:00schestowitzSun too did this with OpenSolaris… ‘announcing’ it a zillion times saying “This is IT! This is THE release.” After some powwow in the press, which thought it was really news, there was nothing.Oct 29 18:01schestowitzAnd same with Vista 7. Oct 29 18:01schestowitzMicrosoft showed some ‘leaked’ (fake ‘leaks’.. like viral blogs) of Vista 7 before.Oct 29 18:01schestowitzIt’s a Vista with some selective screen captures of new buttons, wallpapers and slapstick.Oct 29 18:02schestowitzVista 7 IS Mojave. It’s Vista under another name.Oct 29 18:02_Doug‘THE Labor Party has removed all speeches from the lead-up to the last election from its website amid claims of plagiarism in politics .. “We are just trying to keep the website as up to date as possible,” Mr Bitar said. ‘Oct 29 18:06_Doughttp://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0…Oct 29 18:06schestowitzLinux-based smartphone now just $179.99 : http://www.pcworld.com/article/152… (take that, Apple)Oct 29 18:08schestowitzBut Google’s Android is faux-sourceOct 29 18:08schestowitzYou can’t build the s/w for other phones. Same with Chrome, AKAIK.Oct 29 18:08schestowitzAFAIKOct 29 18:08schestowitzApple and Microsoft hand in glove: http://www.pcworld.com/article/15… ( iTunes 8 to Vista: Give Me a B, an S, an OD )Oct 29 18:10schestowitzFujitsu Cuts Financial Outlook on Tough Market, Strong Yen Oct 29 18:11_Dougkeeping the campaign clean: tying Obama to middel-eastern terrorists ..Oct 29 18:11_Doughttp://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=9LxOMX57kOcOct 29 18:11schestowitzThe US needs someone more respected. As someone said to me, this year’s candidates are both iffy. Palin and McCain are much worse.Oct 29 18:14_DougMcCain called Obama too intellectual ?Oct 29 18:17schestowitzIt’s weird that David M Williams covers a story like this: http://www.itwire.com/content/view/21410/1054/ He’s very pro-Linux. Weird…Oct 29 18:18_Doug“MYOB .. is being re-engineered using leading edge Microsoft technologies”Oct 29 18:22_Dougwha ?Oct 29 18:22_Doug“MYOB makes the move to SQL Server, .NET “Oct 29 18:23_Dougis this the same leading edge technologies that powers the NHS and the LSE ?Oct 29 18:24schestowitz iSoft outsources NHS work to India: http://politics.guardian.co.uk/e…Oct 29 18:25schestowitz“But despite having placed its offices close to Manchester’s three main higher education institutions, iSoft’s chief executive, Patrick Cryne, admitted yesterday that much of the software manufacturing work will be done at its new facility in Chennai (Madras), India. “Oct 29 18:25schestowitzNHS Scotland pools budget for Microsoft savings Oct 29 18:26_DougI wonder what they gave MYOB to ‘invest’ in SQL.NETOct 29 18:26schestowitzhttp://radar.oreilly.com/20… “We can not afford to take the risk of a Vice-President (especially for a candidate as old as McCain) who is scornful of science, denies human involvement in creating climate change, and is completely unprepared to tackle this most urgent of problems.”Oct 29 18:28_DougMYOB, only on Mac or longVista 7Oct 29 18:28libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 18:34schestowitzLongVista. I like that. They tried to dodge the LH name around 2005 when it collapsed and got direputed.Oct 29 18:37trmancohttp://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/29/technology/b…Oct 29 18:53schestowitzBrilliant post from Adam Williams about Ubuntu: http://www.happyassassin.net/2008/…Oct 29 18:53schestowitztrmanco: I don’t bother mentioning Vista 7. That, too, will go the way of the dodoOct 29 18:54trmancofor sure it willOct 29 18:54schestowitzIf it appears some time in 2010 (maybe), then it’ll soon turn out to be just another Vista, despite the ads.Oct 29 18:54schestowitzSame Vista DRM prison.Oct 29 18:54schestowitzSame underlying codebase that’s a mess.. too much for Microsoft’s engineers to manage.Oct 29 18:55schestowitzThey promised to make it modular. Did they do it? No, not this time. So it’s still goo.Oct 29 18:55MinceRi wouldn’t call them engineersOct 29 18:55schestowitzThey said it would boot fast… well, they soon forgot all about that promise and ran away to hide under a rock.Oct 29 18:55schestowitzMS-Certified Sandwich engineers (MCSE)?Oct 29 18:56schestowitzOct 29 18:56schestowitzEither way, all their code slingers seem to be leaving.Oct 29 18:56schestowitzhb-1 without any familiarity with the code take over and probably break a lot of stuff.Oct 29 18:56schestowitziTunes 8 to Vista: Give Me a B, an S, an OD Oct 29 18:57schestowitzhttp://mdzlog.wordpress.com/… “There are currently over 46000 open Ubuntu bug reports in Launchpad.”Oct 29 19:03MinceRMinesweeper Consultants and Solitaire ExpertsOct 29 19:03schestowitzInteresting. http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/re… “I’m sure Asus has their reasons for not allowing a download of the restore ISO. Perhaps they are under some legal obligation to keep it off the digital shelves.”Oct 29 19:09schestowitz“As it stands now, I can’t put Xandros back onto my EeePC. Thankfully, there are alternatives.”Oct 29 19:10MinceRwho misses xandros anyway? :>Oct 29 19:10schestowitzDo the Dellbuntu laptops come with a recovery CD?Oct 29 19:10schestowitzThe point I’m looking at in Shawn’s article is to do with codec licences and all… and Xandros.Oct 29 19:11schestowitzKDE gets the attention of researchers: New KTorrent version plugs security vulnerabilities ( http://www.heise-online.co.uk/open/Ne… )Oct 29 19:13trmancohttp://www.informationweek.com/news/windows/o…Oct 29 19:22schestowitzGoogle Attacks The Messenger Over Android Vulnerability Oct 29 19:24pombat42 (n=pombat42@ool-182dda9f.dyn.optonline.net) has left #boycottnovell (“Leaving”)Oct 29 19:26schestowitzThey can optimise the installation/build, trmanco. It’s also possible to slim down Vista and to show something moving on 500 MB of RAM.Oct 29 19:27trmancoslim down vistaOct 29 19:28trmancobetter slim down XP thenOct 29 19:28trmancoeven moreOct 29 19:28trmancoBRBOct 29 19:28schestowitzVista ran on netbooks too, if you tired /hard/.Oct 29 19:29schestowitzTrying hard for demo purposes isn’t enough. http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/the_sporting_b…Oct 29 19:29MinceRdoes novell receive payment for suse on the MSI Wind and the HP 2133 Mini-Note PC?Oct 29 19:30schestowitzI don’t know.Oct 29 19:31schestowitzMicrosoft probably gets paid though. They take a portion from Novell.Oct 29 19:31trmancohttp://news.netcraft.com/archives/2008/10/29…Oct 29 19:55schestowitz“Apache once again shows the largest growth, gaining 463 thousand sites this month.”Oct 29 19:56schestowitz“What’s a Lynus?” http://gizmodo.com/5070019/walmart…Oct 29 19:59schestowitzIBM is feeding the Yankee Group. Bad IBM. http://elibrary.line56.com/detail/RES/12249…Oct 29 20:00schestowitzAnd later Microsoft pays these shills as well and they produce something against Linux. Same with the Linux Foundation and IDC (Al Gillen and other sellouts)Oct 29 20:01[H]omer has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Oct 29 20:01schestowitzWe ought to mention FOSS projects more. Just got this mail from a reader: “I can’t remember which article I was going to comment on. It was more than afew hours ago and I got interrupted. But my comment was to make a reminder to always name at least one real technology in each article, per MS imitation.”Oct 29 20:03schestowitz“Look at it this way: if they can keep you complaining about their product, at least your preoccupied with theirs and not the real ones. Might keep a mapping table handy. If product X gets mentioned by MSFTers, respond with Red Hat and Ubuntu. if Y, then Apache and Lighttpd. If Z then thunderbird with lightning. If W then OOo, etc.”Oct 29 20:04schestowitz“sponsored by IBM” http://elibrary.line56.com/detail/RES… Yankee Lie(C). Next, please. $20,000 per ‘study’?Oct 29 20:04*[H]omer (n=[H]omer@moscow.perfect-privacy.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 20:08ChanServ gives channel operator status to [H]omerOct 29 20:08pombat42 (n=pombat42@ool-182dda9f.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 20:13schestowitzhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/… ” His warning follows an admission yesterday by Jacqui Smith that the technical work on creating a giant centralised database of all email, text, phone and web traffic will go ahead, despite the fact that ministers have decided to delay the legislation needed to set it up and instead put the proposal out to consultation.”Oct 29 20:32schestowitzhttp://www.heise-online.co.uk/news/Schne… “Schneier: Enjoy surveillance while it is still visible. Measures such as ID cards are a temporary measure before biometric technology becomes ubiquitous; That was the warning from security guru Bruce Schneier this week who claims that surveillance technology will get more sophisticated and, more importantly, smaller and harder to deteOct 29 20:34schestowitzct”Oct 29 20:34*_Doug has quit ()Oct 29 20:40trmancohttp://www.engadget.com/2008/10/28/…Oct 29 21:04schestowitzLeave Vista 7 alone. Seen that H-P thing yet? Oct 29 21:04trmanconopOct 29 21:04schestowitzhttp://news.cnet.com/8301-17938… http://blogs.zdnet.com/BTL/?p=10613Oct 29 21:04schestowitzhttp://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/…Oct 29 21:04trmanco looksOct 29 21:05schestowitzThey tried to deny the BusinessWeek article from last month about H-P dodging Vista and Microsoft to build a custom GNU/Linux… they were right.Oct 29 21:05schestowitzBig newsOct 29 21:05schestowitzNo SIGNS of SUSE (H-P used to stock SLED)!Oct 29 21:05schestowitzbenJIman will be thrilled that H-P canned SUSE.Oct 29 21:06schestowitzhttp://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-1053… “The real news here is that HP DROPPED SUSE FOR UBUNTU!!! “Oct 29 21:06trmancohahaOct 29 21:08trmanconow going back to the one I mentionedOct 29 21:10trmanco“We’ve always known Microsoft intends Windows 7 to run on netbooks, and we got a small taste during the PDC keynote: Windows SVP Steve Sinofsky held up his “personal” laptop running Windows 7, an unnamed 1GHz netbook with 1GB of RAM that looked a lot like an Eee PC, and said that it still had about half its memory free after boot. (We’re guessing it was running a VIA Nano, given the announcement this morning and since most Atoms run aOct 29 21:10trmancot 1.6GHz.)”Oct 29 21:10trmancohmmmOct 29 21:10trmancohalf is goodOct 29 21:10trmancoI wonder how bloated and cluttered It will become after installing all those proprietary driversOct 29 21:11trmanco512MB a, Linux can do a lot better, Windows has a lot to catchOct 29 21:12trmanco“At the other end of the scale, Windows 7 supports machines with up to 256 CPUs.”Oct 29 21:12trmancoI wonder how many cpu’s Linux supports ?Oct 29 21:12schestowitzIt’s all vapourware.Oct 29 21:12schestowitzIt’s a demo. Wait until the hocus pocus show endsOct 29 21:12trmanco is waitingOct 29 21:13schestowitzThey do this to freeze the market… give home to naive companies.Oct 29 21:13schestowitzPC makers move closer to a post-Windows world . Savour another victory.Oct 29 21:26*_Doug (n=_Doug@ip-217-204-51-230.easynet.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 21:28_Dougwhen Cray ruled the world ..Oct 29 21:31_Doughttp://www.theregister.co.uk/…Oct 29 21:31twitterHeh, even the Wintel press is getting tired of waiting http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/215739Oct 29 21:31trmancohmmOct 29 21:31trmancoU just came up with somethingOct 29 21:31trmancoIOct 29 21:31schestowitzTa for the link!Oct 29 21:32twitterWindows 7 is Vista with a new coat of paint, Azure is Hailstone 2.0, ouch.Oct 29 21:32schestowitzYesOct 29 21:32schestowitzJoel Spolsky said so too.Oct 29 21:32schestowitz Hailstone I mean…Oct 29 21:32trmancohttp://blog.somekool.net/files/kde… | http://media.arstechnica.com/images/wind… == Looks like we have twinsOct 29 21:32schestowitzHe said that several months ago though.Oct 29 21:32trmancoI’ mostly referring to the start menuOct 29 21:33schestowitzVista 7 Fisher Price Edition. :-0Oct 29 21:33trmancololOct 29 21:33twittermeanwhile compiz fusion runs on first generation eeepc.Oct 29 21:34schestowitz“Just as slow as Vista. In fact, Windows 7′s performance is virtually identical to that of Vista SP1 on the same hardware. If you were unhappy with Vista’s CPU-hogging, memory-sucking ways, Windows 7 will provide little relief.”Oct 29 21:34schestowitzSee, trmanco, I told you.Oct 29 21:34schestowitzYes, KDE4 runs on Netbooks with eye candy too.Oct 29 21:34trmancoAaggrOct 29 21:35schestowitzWe have a winner. Vista 7 is another loser, so the winners are Apple and GNUOct 29 21:35trmancoMicrosoft sure does innovateOct 29 21:35schestowitzMarketing innovationsOct 29 21:35schestowitzHow to ‘leak’ screenshotsOct 29 21:35schestowitzHow to ‘demo’ for performance and rename products.Oct 29 21:36trmancobetter KDE screenshot -> http://www.ngohq.com/attachments/general-softwa…Oct 29 21:36schestowitzAs I said earlier, Vista 7 is the Real Slim Sha… eerrr… the Real Mojave.Oct 29 21:36trmancololOct 29 21:36trmancoooo MojaveeeééOct 29 21:36trmancocrapOct 29 21:38trmancoI don’t remember what was the name of one of M$ services that ripped off Canonical’s logoOct 29 21:38trmancoAlumniOct 29 21:39trmancohttp://msanet.org/Oct 29 21:40trmancohahaOct 29 21:40twitterInteresting, coming from this source http://www.alleyinsider.com/2008/10/mi…Oct 29 21:41schestowitzI remember that.Oct 29 21:41schestowitzBut it’s a generic logoOct 29 21:41schestowitzNo-one stole anything.Oct 29 21:41MinceRlooks a lot like the edubuntu logoOct 29 21:41pombat42 has quit (Remote closed the connection)Oct 29 21:41schestowitztwitter: the big news is about H-POct 29 21:41twitteroh?Oct 29 21:41twitterOh! “non-Windows PC in stores.”Oct 29 21:43twitterniceOct 29 21:43schestowitztwitter: Your slalkers bark again. http://boycottnovell.com/2008/10/29/mso…Oct 29 21:44twitterwoof woof. Nothing of value was added.Oct 29 21:52twitter” None of this should suggest that Microsoft is in some death spiral.” No, not at all. Just 8 years without a successful main product launch and declining revenue.Oct 29 21:54twitterIt’s like they read my Death Watch journal.Oct 29 21:54schestowitz“I’d be glad to help tilt lotus into into the death spiral. I could do it Friday afternoon but not Saturday. I could do it pretty much any time the following week.” –Brad Silverberg, MicrosoftOct 29 21:55twitterHere’s a couple of older HP articles announcing their intentions and reasoning. http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?… http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl…Oct 29 21:57twitterGotta love the Vista Failure Log.Oct 29 21:57twitterOct 29 21:57trmanco has quit (“I just hit the close button :)”)Oct 29 22:04schestowitzQuickie: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/10/29/h…Oct 29 22:05schestowitzThis is old… HP CEO: Vista Never Had Its Moment in 2007 Oct 29 22:06twitterYeah, I told you it was old.Oct 29 22:09twitterBut they planned on doing something and now it’s here. What other HP news was there?Oct 29 22:10twitterahhh, UbuntuOct 29 22:10twitterthat’s nice.Oct 29 22:10twitterI broke my Konqueror. :’( need to start article submission again.Oct 29 22:12twitterbut all of the links are right here.Oct 29 22:12schestowitzhttp://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/2334… ZOMG. With /open source/ tool? What does that have to do with the flaw?Oct 29 22:13twitterYou have to be careful with oyster knives. They look dull but will go right through your thumb muscle if you slip.Oct 29 22:14schestowitzSwiss Army knives too. I was unfortunate to find out.Oct 29 22:16schestowitzNo BlackBerry Open Source OS Confirmed by RIM Oct 29 22:17schestowitzEating Microsoft’s lunch: http://www.insidehighered.com/news/200… “Meanwhile, although enterprise, license-based learning management platforms continue to dominate the higher education landscape (56.8 percent use Blackboard, down from 66.3 percent last year), the potential for increasing open source adoption remains. “Oct 29 22:18_Doug is now known as clonebotOct 29 22:24clonebotOct 29 22:24clonebotgtg ..Oct 29 22:24clonebot has quit ()Oct 29 22:24schestowitzMicrosoft warns of financial crisis email scams Oct 29 22:40schestowitzThose scams arrive from Microsoft Windows botnets.Oct 29 22:41twitterHP news is off to the races http://slashdot.org/firehose.p…Oct 29 22:44twitterBotnets, M$’s unique contribution to distributed computing.Oct 29 22:45twitterHere’s something funny. http://uk.youtube.com/watch…Oct 29 22:50twitterI think I’ll make it the theme song of the M$ Death Watch.Oct 29 22:50pombat42 (n=pombat42@ool-182dda9f.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 22:50schestowitzLOLOct 29 22:51schestowitzTroling: Will the Motorola gamble hurt open source Oct 29 22:56schestowitzTrolling with a provocative headlineOct 29 22:57pombat42 has quit (“Leaving”)Oct 29 23:01libervisco has quit (“Remember, remember the fifth of november…”)Oct 29 23:16schestowitzMandelson’s dept mulls UK internet power grab ; DHS cybersecurity boss fights back against critics Oct 29 23:18*libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovellOct 29 23:18schestowitzNice oh him…: “I can make. Roy is a good guy, he’s actually taking out the meat and lay it on the table.” Oct 29 23:33MinceRgnOct 29 23:34schestowitzCheap Apple… Psystar planning Mac OS X notebook Oct 29 23:41schestowitzFedora for OLPC being sold… Fedora 10 on SD Card for the OLPC Laptop Oct 29 23:42schestowitzTeenage cyber-criminals run riot Oct 29 23:45schestowitzhttp://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/10/28… “With all eyes on turbulent global financial markets, Britain’s Prince Charles has issued a stark warning about climate change.”Oct 29 23:57
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